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Online Casinos in general: Reportage - Online casinos: Money back from illegal gambling (Page 4)

Topic created on 08th Sep. 2018 | Page: 4 of 25 | Answers: 248 | Views: 123,018
s****e
Right, but why is the refund at Risk if I cancel
cancel an illegal booking?
As long as I pay my installments on time, nothing happens.
You are right about the change in net worth.
However, if I earn enough, have 5000€ on the side, and
let back e.g. 1000€, where have then my
Wealth circumstances seriously changed?

Oh yes, a Schufaeintrag is also not possible. For this
there are in the Internet enough rechtsanwaltschaftliche estimates.
One merely books back an "illegal" deposit.

Other banks will not find out about this either.

If they do, they will be able to sue successfully.

The rejection of a loan must also be disclosed.
If the banks were to exchange information with each other, this would again be
not in compliance with the law.

It may be true that there are serious problems behind this. Probably
not with everyone, but with many.
But that would be a different topic.

This post has been translated automatically

Anonym
Would like to briefly get rid of something to Matthias his statement...

... if I had the opportunity to get my lost money back, I would definitely consider it

The question that arises with me now is whether it is as simple as it is often claimed by lawyers, because in this respect you must not forget that it is lawyers of course also only about their own economic interests.

To me in addition... therefore the next question would be, which I would harm thereby?
The bank or the casino, or vlt also both?

In my opinion, this is completely irrelevant, because neither of them is pitiful in my eyes. Did they feel sorry for me when they enriched themselves from me? Probably not

It would be possible in the today's time for a bank to protect players, by payments are not transferred, this procedure would serve besides also the own protection against illegal business transactions. Since it was said in good German "shit", you need not be surprised that the pile sooner or later now lands on your own doorstep.

I can understand your speech completely, even if it is to spread the appearance, that you philosophize broadly, that is not however so, because in the same breath you conjure unfortunately apocalyptic consequences for all citizens, if players would consider a reclaim of the money. This clearly speaks to the fact that your words represent the opinion from the point of view of a businessman, so unfortunately not neutral

Positive is that you mention that one should wait because of the ignorance, but honestly, if no one would start to Risk something, nothing would change in millions of years...
because the greed for more rules everywhere.



This post has been translated automatically

Matthias
Expert
stkrie wrote on 08/09/2018 at 14:53
When is the bank allowed to cancel the current account ?

According to § 19 AGB banks may terminate an overdraft only if the following conditions are met :

  1. significant deterioration in the financial situation of the debtor



That is exactly the point. A significant deterioration of the debtor's financial situation.
If you need to withdraw money that you have gambled away, your financial situation cannot be good.
Furthermore, the Risk of default is significantly increased in the case of an account holder who is addicted to gambling.

I will not give instructions or tips on how to book money back anywhere here on GambleJoe, because I myself simply cannot estimate what negative effects it can have. I also don't want to be responsible if someone has to fight with judges and lawyers in a few months and the costs are not covered by the legal protection insurance. Is it covered at all that one sues a bank for "aiding and abetting illicit gambling by providing payment services" - especially if one was the only organically executing body?

I unlike you, stand here as a platform operator before our community
You are unfortunately nothing more than 1 nickname of 3000 other members and after revealing your "valuable tips" you can delete yourself overnight and erase your identity.

This post has been translated automatically

s****e
but essential means that the serious repayment of the loan is at risk.
should this really be the case, then i agree with you. then you might wake sleeping
dogs!

it is clear that you do not give any instructions, nobody expected that.
but that you predict things here, which are not true, doesn't have to be, does it?
not be, right?

Incidentally, you can expect from a platform operator that he brings objective
Criticism, instead of reacting like this. I give here no tips, I put your
Statements correctly!

Quote:
You are unfortunately nothing more than a nickname of 3000 and after revealing your "valuable tips" you can delete yourself and erase your identity overnight

That says everything about you!

Yes, unfortunately I am only one of the 3000 users. The users who have made GJ great. Thereby I exclude myself of course
out, since I am an "only"!
That you write in addition still unfortunately, does not make it better!
And provocations do not help there also further.
Please remain objective, as you also demand that from me!

This post has been translated automatically

Matthias
Expert
stkrie wrote on 08/09/2018 at 15:34
Quote:
You are unfortunately nothing more than a nickname of 3000 and after revealing your "valuable tips" you can delete yourself overnight and erase your identity
That says everything about you!
Yes, unfortunately I am only one of the 3000 users. The users who made GJ great.

It's the truth - you can delete yourself overnight, but in the future thousands more will read what you wrote/recommended here on the forum.

You have more warnings with us than any other member . You have meanwhile scared away over 10 new members with your rude, provocative manner. Julian and Christoph will be able to confirm this. Furthermore, we often discuss whether we want to continue to look at how you provoke new members.
It may be that you write a lot in the forum and often also rumpöbelst, however you have never uploaded a winning picture, never uploaded a winning video, not yet a single game rated.
Only 3 casino reviews you have given. YOU alone have certainly not made GambleJoe great. Others were clearly more diligent.

But now please back to topic.

This post has been translated automatically

s****e
Yes I know, for example the x2 winning picture, so that the
Points for the lottery can be scraped together.
That is of course an extraordinary achievement.
Let's leave out the PSC lottery, let's see how many then
still upload pictures here.

Thanks for the hint for the most warnings.
Strangely enough, I can discuss such topics with Matthias normally
discuss normally, only with you it usually degenerates.

whether these 10 members have really said goodbye because of me,
there are still some who have a score to settle with me
and would love to see me banned.
i would always be careful with new members.

By the way, i have never claimed to have made GJ great, i have
i even clearly distanced myself from it in the last post

Furthermore, and I say it again, I do not recommend anything, but have only
only checked your statements on the truth content, and now I am attacked
attacked by you.

Everyone here can find out for themselves how it looks with the chargeback.
there are enough tips circulating on the internet, so we are not discussing anything new here!


This post has been translated automatically

Anonym
Guys calm down, it's not that simple.

Don't always believe everything you see on TV


I have contact with a well-known online casino owner (do not want to name names here) with whom I have often talked exactly about it.
The has top lawyers and has assured me again and again that they will have no problems according to the current legal situation to offer their offer in Germany.
This is covered by EU law.

Of course, it's all very opaque and that's why it's always discussed because very few people see through it and it could actually be interpreted differently in the final instance.

According to higher-level EU law, however, the casinos behave in a legally compliant manner.
To file a lawsuit on a national level, which is covered by an overriding EU law, should be quite difficult.

It may well succeed in individual cases to get the money, you just have to expect then to go through several instances, you need very good lawyers in the field and you have, before you get even a cent from the banks, times first quite a lot of costs that come to you that can go into the 5 digit sum. But then you have to deal with top lawyers who delay the process forever and thus let you bleed out financially. And then it is a matter of luck which presentation is followed, because here national law and EU law meet, etc.

I am also friends with a lawyer who specializes in gambling law and he said to me for a sum that is less than a dispute value of 30,000 it does not pay to even try.


Is already clear that a 7 minute contribution, which one has to research probably in a day together has not come across now so.

If the legal situation would be so clear German players would not be accepted and one would concentrate on other markets.


So everyone who got wet dreams now and thinks he can just get his few thousand back, should think twice if he wants to take the Risk with an unclear outcome and can spend a few thousand as initial capital to get the legal machinery running.


I remain then nevertheless rather with the personal responsibility.
Each play addict knows nevertheless exactly which happens even if he would get actually money back. Off to the state casino and just there the money then gamble away.

Solve the Gambling addiction problem, then you solve most problems in your life.
And most of all, you still hurt the casinos when you no longer pay in or just very little.

This post has been translated automatically

Matthias
Expert
Random wrote on 08/09/2018 at 16:04: Guys calm down, it's not that simple.

Don't always believe everything that's on TV

[Intertitle removed]

I prefer to stay with personal responsibility.
Every gambling addict knows exactly what happens even if he actually would get money back. Off to the state casino and just there the money then gamble away.

Solve the Gambling addiction problem, then you solve most problems in your life.
And most of all, you still hurt the casinos when you no longer pay in or just very little.

Word!

If you really want to harm a casino:
simply does not pay in! The casinos still have their personnel costs and you yourself don't lose any money. That hurts the casinos the most

This post has been translated automatically

briniberlin86
Rookie
Matthias wrote on 08/09/2018 at 11:54 am: Good morning everyone,

i too have seen the TV report and can imagine that this is now going through the media and maybe some really try to repatriate funds.
First of all, I want to apologize right away for possibly writing very emotionally in this post. My gambler and entrepreneur thinking meets a very big conflict here, especially because I have used / lost a lot of money.

What goes through my mind: 5 million Germans gamble regularly, 25% of them in Online Casinos, especially because of all the TV commercials. If now 1.25 million people have deposited money in online casinos - one only 50 euros, the other 1000 euros, some even 10,000 euros, or even much more... (seen over the last few years)
And now all come on the idea to reclaim the money, which they have directed SELF...
The damage to the banks would be so immense that it would be crazy to think that this would work with a "I'll go to the bank and have my bets booked back". 1.25 million players who deposited on average 1000€ -> 1.250.000.000 Euro damage (1.25 billion Euro) - I think the damage is even much higher... I don't know, maybe I really lack the brainpower to imagine what would happen then.

The fact is, you do not harm the online casinos, but almost exclusively the banks in Germany, which are already struggling under the low interest rate policy.
The online casinos have already received the money and do not have to pay it back!
I would before such an attempt first withdraw all savings and check whether any loans are still running. Everyone knows that banks are greedy, and as soon as you deprive the banks of their money, they will certainly not be squeamish to "hit back"

My view as a bank:
As a bank, I would really punch any customer who subsequently "stole" money from me that I had forwarded for them as a payment processor.
I would 1. delay the matter as long as possible, go to court and fight to the end and if I really have to pay, cancel all loans to the customer. Because who wants to do business with such a customer? Furthermore, I would pass on the information that the customer has deceived me to all banks (to the competition), so that this customer is not classified as creditworthy again in his life. I.e. all plans for the future, building society contracts, house financing, etc. would all be on the line, and the life of a person is usually relatively long and the demands and plans change sometimes...

My view as a player:
I would keep an eye on the matter, seriously think about it and calculate whether I really have the balls in the pants - and whether it is worth it for the money to slam my house bank a letter on the table "I want my money back" (so easy it will certainly not)
Honestly, my economic thinking comes up again and I remember what I wrote above at "My view as a bank". You deliberately cause harm to someone else (even if it's a shitty bank), even though you are responsible for it yourself.
So for me, at this point, it becomes really difficult to think clearly and only from a player's perspective.
I started from scratch, my parents were never wealthy, and I started my own business after my education. I was always responsible for everything myself, never dependent on others.
I also took out loans, once had problems paying the tax office, worked more and more for it, and to this day I am paying off my mistakes from the past.
If I could book back all the stakes I ever deposited in casinos... I would be rich. Just remember that I also paid out money (so I get to keep that??) So I am enriching myself by taking back the stakes but keeping the wins? /Irony to "What a cool principle! I think this is the solution to all problems" /irony off

If it really all worked out that way, I would be uncreditworthy with all banks in Germany for the rest of my life, but I would have paid off my debts and could finance a nice house. Oh well, I don't get a loan for the house financing, well maybe the money is enough for a two-room apartment in Berlin.
There I live then, happily, without debts in my paid off apartment. The only problem is that I might not even have a bank account anymore, although digital payment or cash abolition will probably be the future. And it would probably always be with the fear in the neck that you can't even get a cell phone contract anymore, because the future of the banks probably looks more and more networked
And the banks don't forget anything. I don't think you can think the whole thing through to the end, and as long as you're not 100% aware of all the consequences, you shouldn't be fighting over money.
But what I forgot: Charging the money back, in NO WAY solves the Gambling addiction problem. Even if it works, you have money in your account, which will then end up in the state casinos the next time you have an addiction attack. What has one then been able to do? Bank account gone, credit rating in the bucket, addiction not treated and money again futsch.
I will continue to monitor the issue and first see how this develops and what consequences the people who try this have to bear before I make any promises such as "Yes, go ahead, get the money back"... To advise others ignorantly (without their own experience) and possibly trigger massive problems is not my thing.

Oh guys and gals, I think many can't relate to my view of things. Probably many think only of the moment "but now I absolutely need the 3000 euros that I lost because I have to pay my rent". I can understand all of this, thought in the short term... But who really has this intention, should in my eyes first really urgently to the addiction counseling center, or to the psychotherapist, to talk about the problems. Perhaps he can then also give a recommendation, what you can do against it, so as not to throw the possibly reversed money back into the machine.

Do you think the banks are liable? I think not! Let's assume that a direct debit is reversed, the bank would certainly not be liable for the costs incurred, but the seller/provider would have to pay for it.
I think in this case similar.
But what will be for sure is that the online casinos where account holders will now so get their coal back all block. If not even in the worst case with too high losses of the casino providers they throw Germans completely out to counteract the danger.
Thus remain then online with the Hollstein law unfortunately hardly casinos for Germany. What I personally would also find a real pity.
I have over 7 years also had so many losses that it would be worthwhile for me to run to my bank and act so. But I have also cleared exactly in these casinos the fattest wins. What has never happened to me in these Hollstein license system sheds.

So I want to win now continue to have fun and must certainly expect losses or do I want to get my money back never again be allowed to play at good providers and bore me to death?

I think that everyone must know for themselves. I only know that now because of this contribution to many German players we will all suffer.
And I do not want to feed the gambling houses kebab machines and casinos with certainty then out of frustration and boredom with my coal and in the end have nothing or far too rare success experiences.

This post has been translated automatically

M****7
Hello people

i have Tuesday my first consultation with the lawyer for banking law. I will claim back my gambled stakes from PayPal as well as from my bank and if necessary I will sue for it!
Gambling addiction is a recognized disease and I was not able to control my gambling behavior. Only an inpatient therapy over 16 weeks helped me to get my life back under control to some extent.
I have been "dry" for quite some time now.

I am also ready to make my vita public as a gambler for many years and to go public.
Gambling addiction is and remains a terrible and serious disease. Casinos do not live from "recreational gamblers" and those who can control their gambling. No, they live exclusively from sick gamblers like I unfortunately am. And I really hope that all this crap will finally be banned!

Gambling ruins thousands of livelihoods in Germany alone and anyone who thinks that you just have to stop or that you can control yourself is very much mistaken.
It is absolutely sick and I know what I'm talking about.

In the end I will try everything to get a part of my gambled money refunded
Should I feel sorry for the banks or other payment companies?
Please, this whole thing is being tacitly supported. Why doesn't a bank react if, for example, you make instant transfers to an online casino for several thousand euros in just one day?

I go in any case to the last instance and I can hardly imagine that the banks can use such bad publicity
Whether it takes a few months or a few years, I pull this through with legal help

Greeting,
Matzo

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