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Online Casinos in general: Police summons (Page 2)

Topic created on 07th Oct. 2024 | Page: 2 of 3 | Answers: 37 | Views: 4,115
Simbda
Top Member

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 06:16 pm CEST#17
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RebellYell wrote on 07.10.2024 at 15:39:

You deposited 12 euros once and paid out 90 euros once. And that's why the summons to the police?

Laughing stock Welcome to the banana republic. The costs are much higher because of the effort involved.

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Carmilies
Top Member

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 06:25 pm CEST#18
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Thank you for all your answers!

I was still with Postbank at the time.

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Comingsoon19
Experienced

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 06:28 pm CEST#19
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I really think it's a bit of a shame how some members are talking this down here. The rules have been clear in Germany since 2021. Anyone who nevertheless plays in unlicensed casinos from Germany may unfortunately have to reckon with consequences, as has been written here since 2021. Unfortunately, everything is legitimate even if the amount is relatively small. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that your case will be dropped.

VG

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Julian
Elite

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 06:39 pm CEST#20
4 Likes
Guys, I can understand that the topic or the discussion seems very charged.
However, I would like to ask you to continue to refrain from political discussions here in the thread and generally in the entire forum.
This is not the right place to discuss economic policy / corona or other political topics.
I therefore ask you to return to the actual topic and focus on it.
Further political content will otherwise be deleted without comment.

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roccoammo11
Expert

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 07:47 pm CEST#21
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Carmilies wrote on 07.10.2024 at 12:02: Hello,

I am completely overwhelmed with the situation and don't really know what to do and would be happy if you had tips and advice.

I received a letter from the police on October 1, 2024, asking me to appear as a defendant at the police station on October 9, 2024.

For involvement in illegal gambling on Tuesday 4.4.2023.

What should I do now?

Thank you for all your tips and advice.

does the casino actually pay out instantly? so if you are really sure that it can't be anything else then I would probably ignore the letter although the safest way would be to find a lawyer...he could cancel your appointment with the police and request access to the files...if there is really nothing else, it will still cost you a lot...my lawyer would probably pay almost 200€ for it.... The decision is up to you...

why did you change your bank? were there certain reasons for it? The facts of the case seem too small to me and go back so far that you have to ask yourself the question, how did they find out now? don't use your bank account for deposits and withdrawals in illegal casinos anymore.

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Carmilies
Top Member

Police summons

7th Oct. 2024, at 10:19 pm CEST#22
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Liked this post: Avatar von roccoammo11 roccoammo11
Thanks again for your answers! Some of them have helped me a lot! At least I feel a lot better now.

@rocco
I didn't change banks voluntarily, but Postbank had terminated my contract.
This was because I hadn't paid off my overdraft on time (a certain amount each month).
However, this was not true, but Postbank cannot be contacted.
This is already being clarified in court.

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StarGames_Official
Experienced

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 08:53 am CEST#23
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T0uchTheSky wrote on 07.10.2024 at 12:47: This all just sucks. Germany should either ban gambling altogether or lift the restriction.

So what's the point, you can gamble online, but only in casinos with De license and everything is worse compared to other casinos abroad.

Anyone who can still think a bit naturally wants to take the better offer. But no, then you're threatened with legal action. I meant that it's our own money and we don't use it to buy drugs, which is illegal in every country.

A note on this comment: this situation is not specific to Germany at all. In all European countries, you are only allowed to play with licensed providers. All other websites that are not licensed in the country in question are illegal.


In Norway and Austria, this means that you may only play with a single provider. In the UK, Spain and Italy, this applies to several hundred.

It is therefore completely normal for a country to allow gambling and issue a license for it. The problem is when the rules for the licensed participants are MUCH stricter than the rules that the illegals abide by. In the UK, the licensed sites are strict, but allow a lot for the players and the gaming experience is good too - although here too the 5 second spins or similar will soon be introduced. But in the UK, it's not worth playing illegally. In Germany, unfortunately, it's different.

So your conclusion is not correct. The solutions are not just a. "ban everything" or b. "allow the illegals too". If the rules for licensed casinos in Germany were improved (play with 90-94% RTP, sometimes faster spins than 5 seconds and maybe higher than with 1 euro), MUCH LESS people would play in the illegal market.

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TobiSchul92

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 10:12 am CEST#24
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Really crazy with the amount, if it really is just that, it's not worth the effort. I hope that, in the best case scenario, nothing more will come of it.

I wonder what the situation is with Skrill and co My Skrill account was closed just under a month ago (I used it for casino deposits and withdrawals, among other things, but not often and only for small amounts). Reason given in the terms and conditions: "No illegal activities". Unfortunately, I did not receive a precise explanation from support, even when I asked.

The terms and conditions also state that Skrill reserves the right to forward transactions to the relevant authorities. Do I need to worry about this now? I thought I would at least be safe with a wallet.

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Rainmann
Elite

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 10:26 am CEST#25
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StarGames_Official wrote on 08.10.2024 08:53:

A note on this comment: this situation is not specific to Germany at all. In all European countries, you are only allowed to play with the providers licensed there. All other websites that are not licensed in the country in question are illegal.


In Norway and Austria, this means that you may only play with one provider. In the UK, Spain and Italy, this applies to several hundred.

It is therefore completely normal for a country to allow gambling and issue a license for it. The problem is when the rules for the licensed participants are MUCH stricter than the rules that the illegals abide by. In the UK, the licensed sites are strict, but allow a lot for the players and the gaming experience is good too - although here too the 5 second spins or similar will soon be introduced. But it's not worth playing illegally in the UK. In Germany, unfortunately, it's different.

So your conclusion is not correct. The solutions are not just a. "ban everything" or b. "allow the illegals too". If the rules for licensed casinos in Germany were improved (play with 90-94% RTP, sometimes faster spins than 5 seconds and maybe higher than with 1 euro), MUCH LESS people would play in the illegal market.

That's right 👍 RTP needs to be increased because the casinos are stuffing their pockets up to their necks and beyond the way things are going now. It's not just the casinos, it's now the case almost everywhere that greed is getting bigger and bigger.

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frapi07
Elite

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 10:28 am CEST#26
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StarGames_Official wrote on 08.10.2024 08:53:

A note on this comment: this situation is not specific to Germany at all. In all European countries, you are only allowed to play with providers licensed there. All other websites that are not licensed in the country in question are illegal.


In Norway and Austria, this means that you may only play with a single provider. In the UK, Spain and Italy, this applies to several hundred.

It is therefore completely normal for a country to allow gambling and issue a license for it. The problem is when the rules for the licensed participants are MUCH stricter than the rules that the illegals abide by. In the UK, the licensed sites are strict, but allow a lot for the players and the gaming experience is good too - although here too the 5 second spins or similar will soon be introduced. But in the UK, it's not worth playing illegally. In Germany, unfortunately, it's different.

So your conclusion is not correct. The solutions are not just a. "ban everything" or b. "allow the illegals too". If the rules for licensed casinos in Germany were improved (playing with 90-94% RTP, sometimes faster spins than 5 seconds and maybe higher than with 1 euro), MUCH LESS people would play in the illegal market.

I can say something about Italy. I am ALWAYS of the opinion that Italy is decades behind Germany (especially in southern Italy). Bureaucracy is extremely cumbersome there, as German-Italian citizens realize when they want to renew their Italian ID card. I couldn't make an appointment on my own because they were all "internally" busy. In addition, you only have one consulate (Munich) (at least in Bavaria) and therefore always have to go to Munich. This is just one of many examples.


What is done more correctly in Italy, however, is to regulate gambling. As you have already written, there are many legal sites that are allowed to offer online gambling. These providers receive authorization from the ADM (Agenzia delle Dogane - Wikipedia - German Wiki page). So far it is the same as Germany, but now comes the difference: there are no rules that are as stupid as the 5 sec rules or 1€ max bet, high RTP etc.. Instead, there is a session limit rule of €1000, i.e. when you open a slot, you always have a maximum of €1000 at your disposal, regardless of whether you have more credit or not. This is also the reason why many people tend to avoid playing there illegally. Sure, there are players who play at cryptocasinos (offer higher bets, etc.), but when it comes to FIAT providers, I'm sure that fewer players Deposit there than do here, for example, because you simply Risk not receiving your money, while you receive your money at the legal ones and hardly notice any differences.

So I can only agree with your conclusion, because you can see that things are much better elsewhere. Unfortunately, things are going in the wrong direction in Germany. Initially, the RTP was downgraded to 90.4 or so. There are now providers who offer slots with an 84.5 RTP. What's coming soon? RTP of 80% or even 75%? Moreover, 3 years have passed and nothing has changed in those 3 years, neither in a negative nor in a positive way. What has the GGL done? What has the state done apart from dragging "illegal" players into court? Is this how "illegal" gambling is to be combated? Wouldn't it make more sense to introduce regulations that don't put players at a disadvantage and thus minimize the appeal of depositing money there?

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RebellYell
Top Member

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 11:49 am CEST#27
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StarGames_Official wrote on 08.10.2024 08:53:

A note on this comment: this situation is not specific to Germany at all. In all European countries, you are only allowed to play with providers licensed there. All other websites that are not licensed in the country in question are illegal.


In Norway and Austria, this means that you may only play with a single provider. In the UK, Spain and Italy, this applies to several hundred.

It is therefore completely normal for a country to allow gambling and issue a license for it. The problem is when the rules for the licensed participants are MUCH stricter than the rules that the illegals abide by. In the UK, the licensed sites are strict, but allow a lot for the players and the gaming experience is good too - although here too the 5 second spins or similar will soon be introduced. But in the UK, it's not worth playing illegally. In Germany, unfortunately, it's different.

So your conclusion is not correct. The solutions are not just a. "ban everything" or b. "allow the illegals too". If the rules for licensed casinos in Germany were improved (play with 90-94% RTP, sometimes faster spins than 5 seconds and maybe higher than with 1 euro), MUCH LESS people would play in the illegal market.


I don't think the majority of players have a fundamental problem with the fact that there are now licensed casinos here and the state basically only wants people to play in them. The annoying thing is these miserable rules and paternalism. Most annoying of all, of course, are the taxes and the associated low RTPs. The fact that you simply have a significantly worse chance of winning than players abroad is something that really drives me up the wall. Imagine if the Eurolotto only charged an extra tax for German players and the wins were worse. What an outcry there would be......

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Pat1991
Top Member

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 12:44 pm CEST#28
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I don't see why it can't simply be regulated in such a way that there is a blocking file, perhaps Deposit limits, and everything else is the same as in "normal" online casinos.

In other words, the usual international RTP, no (or only minor) restrictions on bets and round duration, and taxation of Online Casinos / operators according to win.

What is the problem?

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gamble1
Icon

Police summons

8th Oct. 2024, at 01:01 pm CEST#29
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Pat1991 wrote on 08.10.2024 at 12:44: I don't see why it isn't simply regulated in such a way that there is a lock file, perhaps Deposit limits, and everything else is the same as in "normal" online casinos.

In other words, the usual international RTP, no (or only minor) restrictions on bets and round duration, and taxation of Online Casinos / operators according to win.

What is the problem?

Well, basically there's no problem, but experts have advised, among other things, to stop fast gambling because it could be addictive

In the actual case, I strongly suspect that for €12 the process is over extremely quickly

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Darkresu85
Rookie

Police summons

9th Oct. 2024, at 01:12 am CEST#30
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gamble1 wrote on 08.10.2024 at 13:01:
Well basically there is no problem but experts have advised to stop the fast game among other things because it could be addictive

In the actual case it should be said: I strongly suspect that for 12 € the procedure is over extremely quickly

But isn't the problem here rather that he had €90 paid out?

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gamble1
Icon

Police summons

9th Oct. 2024, at 01:47 am CEST#31
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Darkresu85 wrote on 09.10.2024 at 01:12:

But isn't the problem here rather that he had 90,- Euro paid out?

Well, the actual act is to use 12 € for illegal gambling


No betting of your own money: If you do not bet any of your own money and only play with free spins, it is not formally a "game for money" in the classic sense.

So if you theoretically play NoDep free spins and withdraw the money directly afterwards, you have not broken any law on paper because only when you use this money afterwards do you take part in gambling before that, as described above, it is not a game for money in the classic sense

So if we assume that the person could have lost the €12 and only reached this €90 through free spins, it could possibly be argued that the act only related to the €12 because only these had a bet with money, i.e. it was a game of chance for money

However, I'm not a lawyer, but I think this is the epitome of minor

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