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Online Casinos in general: Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell? (Page 3)

Topic created on 15th May. 2018 | Page: 3 of 5 | Answers: 44 | Views: 12,093
s****e

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 11:36 am CEST#21
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@ Tim

I take as an example LeoVegas, which among other things got a high fine because of missing or incomplete player protection
have received. Whether this penalty makes up for the revenue generated by the lack of Player protection remains to be seen.
Only LeoVegas knows that.
I maintain, however, that it is worth it, otherwise the Leo would have long since shut down, since it was already at the last control
was criticized.
With Betsson it seems to be the same. Probably worthwhile.

Such a casino can never actually be on the top places.

There should be a few basic criteria. If these are not or only partially fulfilled, then a
a casino should never be recommended. My opinion!

Of course you are right about the bonus.

Now we could argue about whether these so-called bonus rules do not in itself
a reason to be considered unserious! They serve solely to deny new and
and ignorant customers the wins to deny. And that is for a casino a
worthwhile side income!

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Stromberg
Legend

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:03 pm CEST#22
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So I think e.g. Stkrie sees the online gambling or their providers generally as not serious.
Due to e.g. bonus conditions, little or no transparency as far as controls by authorities are concerned, RTPs that are actually hard to control for the player, etc., etc.
I can partly understand the criticism.

But if you now compare the casinos among themselves, there are certainly which are more serious than others. Among other things, because of good support, fast or reasonably fast Verification and payout etc...and in my experience Betsafe and Betsson are among them. I never had any problems and if something was wrong, the support was always able to help.

However, the non-adjustable loss limit is a point of criticism.

That a game breaks off I have also often had, on mobile often with microgaming. Very often, however, already wahrend the game starts.
If during the game, the game was then continued at the same point and I could not feststelleb that it ran worse afterwards. Of course, you can not know.

But if you question the seriousness of online gambling in general, it makes no sense to discuss whether a particular casino is serious or not.


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s****e

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:11 pm CEST#23
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Liked this post: Avatar von Nickii45 Nickii45
That's right. The casinos differ among themselves, of course.

I do not question the seriousness of GambleJoe.

1. GambleJoe can also be wrong, hence the example with VW. No one can guarantee or assure you anything here.
Even good casinos sometimes make problems for no reason

2. Is LeoVegas on the front ranks despite lack of player protection.
Those who want to have their money quickly, Player protection is of course quite indifferent.
They are satisfied with Leo, of course.
The one who is addicted, not.

That should not really be the case

I also had frequent disconnections, even though my Internet was always available.
Of course, this can happen, but the frequency during winning series was striking.


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TimTheBull
Rookie

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:17 pm CEST#24
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Yes, the casinos certainly profit from these "ignorant" but I have a rather critical attitude. As always and everywhere, there are rules, terms and conditions and fine print.
There is clearly the motto first read, then act. On the street I do not constantly sign contracts without reading and on the Internet I should not enter into any contracts or accept terms and conditions without reading them first. And if I do not like the bonus conditions, then I do not accept the bonus or go to another Casiono where the conditions are better.
In my eyes, more personal responsibility is simply required of the people.

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s****e

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:25 pm CEST#25
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I agree with you completely.

However, there are no such general terms and conditions in the usual contracts in Germany because
they would simply not stand up in court. One hears often enough of
corresponding judgments. That is why they are so fond of Malta.

That's why this works so well in Germany, because there is hardly anything like it here.
And the few who try it, are sued by consumer associations or the consumer himself
Consumer itself sued. But this falls flat with the casinos.

Who really reads through everything?
The Microsoft conditions, Amazon-AGB`s, post-AGB`s...... ...
Here one trusts on a certain legal regulation, and therefore flies at least
once one on the snout because of the bonus conditions.
And they are clearly wanted by the casinos.
And that alone is unserious.

I just remember my favorite phrase of the casinos:

Decisions made by casino management are final and cannot be appealed.

By the way, I am a great advocate of personal responsibility. This goes in the today's time
more and more, I agree.
But when you have 30 pages of small print in front of you, most people don't look at it.

And meanwhile I have noticed that some casinos have gone over to splitting bonus rules
split. And only in the normal terms and conditions is then pointed out, among other things, the 5 € Betsize rule, or the
Prohibition of certain games
This is clearly a deception, and in my eyes fraud. In the bonus rules is then namely
on the contrary, exactly the relevant rules I can no longer find there, and must click into the
AGB `s under general bonus rules click.
My brazen it hardly goes!
I can only fall in as a beginner. And even older gamblers this still happens!

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TimTheBull
Rookie

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:43 pm CEST#26
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Yes, most people don't read everything, but that's the problem with the Internet.
People don't realize that they're basically entering into contracts and take it lightly because they don't sign paper.
And in most cases everything goes well and nobody bothers. But if something goes wrong, then the cry is big and it is called fraud, etc.
Each company has its terms and conditions and contractual provisions, it does not matter whether online or in the cell phone store or sonnst wo and you should read it or you let it just not, but then you should not complain afterwards, if the next day the washing machine is in front of the door. ^^

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s****e

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 12:59 pm CEST#27
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But only in the area of Online Casinos are the terms and conditions so assi.
You have to say that quite clearly.

With a normal company in Germany, I usually do not need to look into the terms and conditions,
because they are normal. And if it should not be so, I refuse the payment, and let
and let a court decide. But exactly this instance is missing with OC.

There I can not refuse payment, because I want e.g. 4000€ win from them!

I give you right, nevertheless it makes hardly a person, and this gap is knowingly
exploited

Had already times the example Enkeltrick called. In principle, the seniors themselves are also
Fault. They are not forced to pay. Is meanwhile enough admits. Nevertheless, it is fraud!
Somewhere the personal responsibility stops also times!

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Anonym

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

20th May. 2018, at 01:59 pm CEST#28
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I see this as critical as stkrie, I have also played at several of these Betsson - offshoots (also at Betsafe) and lost my money. Yes, of course they pay out, what else should they do, but even there you go down the drain more often than average, by losing your money completely. What does it mean that it is a listed company from Sweden, what does it say? Is that a proof that this company is serious? Of course, a few million players play there because you want to believe that a company with Swedish roots must be serious.
No, it must not, they have exactly the same motivation as all other casinos . it's about money and only about money . even in large companies is cheated, sometimes one in the company and sometimes it is also the company philosophy, the main thing is to appear respectable to the outside . If someone wants to believe that casinos are serious, then he can continue to do so, but then he should never question why he constantly loses his money and he must constantly Deposit new. I say it again I am very sure that all casinos cheat us players. with some you notice it after the first time and some are just more sophisticated in their actions and you notice it only when it is already too late for one.

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TimTheBull
Rookie

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

21st May. 2018, at 08:33 am CEST#29
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Well, talking about the fact that you lose money in the casino and often "go swimming" is for me now no criticism and certainly no sign of fraud.
That's just how gambling works, in the end the bank always wins, and if one gets a big win, statistically speaking others would have to lose everything.
If I assume that every casino cheats because it makes a win, then I should better keep my hands off gambling^^.
And there are also in Germany companies with shitty AGB 's and to say I weiger mich, brings you also often nothing, because you were pointed out that you should read it and only then sign. And as long as the terms and conditions do not explicitly violate laws, they are also valid.

And if a casino tells me, watch out, I'll give you a €100 bonus, but you can only play with €5 per spin and you have to wager the bonus 40 times, then it's my free decision whether I accept the bonus or not. And if I find these bonus conditions just so grotto bad, then no one prevents me to punish this casino by gambling my money in ner other booth, where the conditions are better. But I have to read and compare before I start gambling.

Honestly, many of us gamble away a lot of money. If we get offered on the street ne Rolex for 50 €, then we think but also and get doubts, or want to see certificates or sonnst what xD
But on the Internet where we gamble 5000 €, we always press on yes yes yes yes in the hope it will somehow fit. xD


In my eyes, the problem with the bonus conditions would solve itself if people would read and compare beforehand and then look for the casino with the best conditions raus. Due to supply and demand, the casinos would then automatically be forced to improve their conditions to keep customers or get new ones. So just works market economy^^. But as long as it works with the more favorable for me AGB 's, why should I change anything, something out of niceness ? xDD

The greatest power is actually we players, because we decide for ourselves where we play, and exactly why everyone should read in my eyes, compare and then there are no unpleasant surprises if but times the big win comes ^^

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s****e

Betsafe - Experiences in a nutshell?

21st May. 2018, at 12:38 pm CEST#30
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Of course you are right
If the whole thing were allowed in Germany, and casinos located here, I would at least have the
Possibility to defend myself legally.

When are Veträge ider AGB immoral?

However, not every clause that two contracting parties have signed is legally valid. Contractual clauses can be void because they violate applicable laws, or they can be immoral because the stronger negotiating partner has imposed contractual conditions on the other that "unduly restrict the latter's ability to act and make business decisions" .

Something like this would have to be clarified in the first place.

Simply to say, one does not have to play, or accept the bonus, is not that. Then the casinos should
completely cancel, and live only on the income over the RTP. Many are here yes the opinion that this is enough for the casinos
enough, since they generate enough revenue. It is not, therefore yes such AGB`s or bonus rules.

In Germany it has then also a completely different media presence. One thinks only of the famous key services
and their rip-off. Almost everyone knows this by now, and many have been forbidden to charge in this way.

The possibilities here are quite different from those in Malta, several kilometers away. In addition still the prohibition in Germany
Under this "protective cloak" they do in principle what they want. And that cannot be.

And if I offer Bonuses to lure people in and rip them off, because every third person falls for it, that is and remains fraud.
I can not simply write everything in my AGB`s purely
The proof that this works, we see every day. And why most sit on Malta, which is a dirt around such
Geschätsgebaren cares, also says everything. Malta wants the tax revenue, the rest is not really interested.

And yes, we have a lot of power. We should all stop, that has always been my opinion. Then the
whole rip-off would stop. Or actually play only in the casinos, welcen a "fair" and transparent
Bonus offer

We are both right I think. Personal responsibility must become greater. At the same time, however, the casinos must be
be forced to delete dubious regulations from the AGB `s!

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