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Bonus & offers: Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus. Reason for this rule?

Topic created on 10th Jun. 2017 | Page: 1 of 1 | Answers: 6 | Views: 2,685
Daniel
Elite

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

10th Jun. 2017, at 08:58 pm CEST#1
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Experienced players know that before accepting a bonus at an online casino, they must read and understand the turnover requirements beforehand and, if in doubt, forgo bonuses. However, inexperienced players usually do not read through the terms and conditions and sometimes experience a nasty surprise when it comes to withdrawals.

The most common "trap" that players fall into is the €5 maximum bet rule, as almost all Online Casinos have these days. This rule is usually found in the terms and conditions or turnover conditions so or so similar:

The maximum bet allowed when using Bonus money is of 5 EUR/GBP per spin or €0.50c/p per bet line until your Wagering requirements have been fulfilled. We reserves the right of voiding bets and winnings resulting from bets of larger amounts.

Or in German

The maximum bet per game allowed while using bonus money is 5 EUR / GBP per spin or € 0.50c/p per bet line until wagering requirements have been fulfilled. We reserve the right to reduce bets and winnings resulting from bets of larger amounts.

In my opinion, many casinos do not point out this important clause clearly enough - but that's another topic ...

I thought for a long time that this is a trap and a dubious practice, which is applied by dubious online casinos in order to legally not have to pay out in the event of a win.

Oddly enough, but also top reputable online casinos have this clause in their terms and conditions. Good casinos also explicitly point to this rule and do not hide it somewhere deep in their terms and conditions. So there must be a meaning behind this regulation. But which one?

In principle, it should be positive for a casino when players win with small stakes and Risk these winnings on high stakes again. Most of them will lose the bonus as well as the winnings quickly. The higher you play, the more you lose (statistically speaking).

Is this just a trap to legally deny the payout to inexperienced players in the event of a win. Or is there a purpose behind it, which is to protect online casinos from bonus fraud?

If this regulation has a morally legitimate reason, then you should theoretically (reproducible) the casinos with high play during the bonus conversion a financial damage and enrich themselves. Then you would only have to look for casinos without this regulation and have a working strategy to make money with online casinos ...

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Daniel
Elite

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

10th Jun. 2017, at 09:02 pm CEST#2
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The Youtube user Max Mustermann, has posted the following comment / theory about this at a current Youtube video:

The smaller the bets are, the less likely it is that you can meet the turnover requirements, because especially high winnings are much less important. The most promising tactic to unlock a bonus is to bet very high, win and then unlock the winnings with very small bets.ï "¿

What do you think?

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J****r

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

11th Jun. 2017, at 01:12 am CEST#3
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So there is already something to it. I think you have to move it anyway, then you can also risk.
But works only very rarely, so I usually do without bonuses. Only when I'm not playing for payout but just want to have a casual gambler evening, I take a bonus with me.

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Clownesk

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

11th Jun. 2017, at 01:35 am CEST#4
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Daniel wrote on 10.06.2017 at 20:58
In principle, yes, it should be positive for a casino when players win with small stakes and Risk these winnings on high stakes again. Most will hereby both the bonus, as well as winnings quickly gamble away again. The higher you play, the more you lose (statistically speaking).

I am the Youtube user "Max Mustermann" and would like to explain my "theory" again.

In doing so, I would also like to address the statement by Daniel quoted above.

Because it is basically true that an increasing stake in the long run always leads to a correspondingly larger loss. Or generally speaking, that you will lose in the long run in games of chance. However, this is not the decisive point when it comes to free spinning bonus money. Because even if you don't stand a chance in the long run, there are very well different promising strategies for free spins, which the casinos take into account with their max-bet clauses. And the central question here is not what makes "typical players" tick (keep increasing the bet after winning), but how to release a bonus as tactically cleverly as possible.

The reason why you can win (highly) in the short term in gambling is known to be the Variance of the games, because just not every round exactly the statistical expected value (RTP), e.g. 96%) is paid out, but in so and so many rounds 0% and in one round for it 10,000% of the stake.

The turnover conditions for Bonus money are usually designed in such a way that you have statistically gambled away the bonus money when you reach the turnover conditions. For example, you Deposit 50 euros and receive 50 euros in bonus money. The 100 euros would now have to be wagered 25 times, resulting in 2500 euros. With a EW of 96%, this would be a statistical loss of 100 euros after playing through (2500 euros * 0.96 = 2400 euros -> -100 euros), ergo the complete money would be statistically gone.

But now the variance comes into play. The smaller you bet, the more rounds are necessary to fulfill the turnover conditions. To show how different strategies are promising, I deliberately choose extreme examples: So I could dispute the 2500 Euro turnover with 5 cent spins or with 10 Euro spins, for example.

With 5 cent spins you would need 50,000 spins, but with 10 euros only 250

With 50,000 spins, approaching the statistical expected value is far more likely than with 250 spins. Even if you were to achieve a 1000x payout once or twice with 5 cents, you would very likely gamble away this "upswing" and experience an approximation of the RTP. For the casino, such a player would be an optimal one, as he will almost certainly fail to meet the turnover requirements.

250 Spins, on the other hand, is such a ridiculously small sample that the results are more or less completely random. Anything is possible here: the immediate complete loss, but also the exorbitant random hit that will most likely keep you way above the expected value until you meet the wagering requirements. This type of player will, of course, give the casino profits in the long run, but will also occasionally make a large payout.

It is completely obvious that no one would seriously opt for variant 1 (unless maximizing playing time was the main focus, which would be the better intention for opting for a bonus anyway).

You can only beat a bonus with the essence of gambling itself, namely with the short-term variance. You don't stand a chance against the RTP in the long run. The casino operators know this, too, which is why (among other things) the maximum limits are written into the terms and conditions of reputable providers.

Since these are mostly around 5 euros, high rollers are particularly strongly disadvantaged. Because they will not be able to avoid playing a larger number of spins if they do not want to violate the rules. While it is never a good idea to play with Bonuses, it is even less so for high rollers. And it is precisely from them that a casino makes the most money. Notice what?

If you have now taken advantage of the essence of gambling, namely the variance, and were able to bring in a respectable profit at the highest possible stakes, again the safest option to get this profit to payout maturity is now to turn the tables and play the smallest possible stakes. This way, you no longer bet on the unpredictable variance, but on the approximation of the RTP in the long run.

So if you have made 2000 Euros from the 100 Euros with luck in the short term, you can now clear this amount relatively risk-free with low stakes. The lower the stakes, the better, because more spins mean more approximation to the RTP.

Finally, it should be said of course:

- Accepting bonuses is almost never a good idea from a purely financial point of view, as long as the focus is not on extending the playing time.
- Also my assumptions are of course model-like, since also for example 50,000 spins do not necessarily have to lead to the RTP and the examples chosen here are already very constructed.
- Those who play without bonuses don't have to fret about obscure and harebrained rules, so just let it be. There is definitely no money given away here, but only money burned.




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Anonym

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

11th Jun. 2017, at 11:40 am CEST#5
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Very interesting. Thank you for the contribution.

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Daniel
Elite

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

11th Jun. 2017, at 11:42 am CEST#6
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Thank you for your detailed contribution. It is true that, from a purely statistical point of view, it is better to play without bonuses. I have already described this in the guide article "Better to play with or without a bonus".

Your theory is also correct. Of course, you usually only have a chance to clear the bonus if you are lucky with higher stakes. But this is true for gambling in general and not only for bonuses. Bonuses are not awarded every time, but usually only 1-2 times a month or as a "gift" for new players.

In casinos, players win from time to time - regardless of whether they have a bonus or not. This is one reason why people participate in gambling. In my opinion, the turnover requirements are sufficient to protect casinos from bonus abuse. And when players win, that's just part of a casino's daily business. In the long run and overall, the casino always wins anyway.

These rules usually apply to all bonuses. That is, even for bonuses where players themselves Deposit money and bear a risk. Of course, there have been players in the past who, through low-risk bets such as the simultaneous setting of red/black in Roulette, were only out to implement the bonus, only to have the gift of the casino paid out. That this is prevented in the terms and conditions I fully understand. Here I would also be fully on the side of the casinos.

Who sets red-black at the same time to implement the bonus also acts with full intent and plays unfairly. In the €5 rule, I personally see but no right sense. I still think this is unfair! At least Online Casinos that have this rule should prevent players from the outset to play larger stakes (as Videoslots it does) or very clearly point out (as it does Wunderino ).

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Anonym

Bonus wagering requirements: 5€ maximum wagering during active bonus....

11th Jun. 2017, at 12:58 pm CEST#7
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To be honest, I don't understand this 5 Euro rule either. Extremely unfair I find here even the line calculation (50 cents per line) This is in my opinion one of the worst tricks to deny the payout. It should be completely banana, which stake I play. I can't agree with your theory 100% either
We are still gambling here. If I would Deposit 100 euros and quickly times with stakes from e.g. 10 euros would come to 2000 euros, then I would no longer need to work

The profit or loss ratios should be as good as the same for the casino, if the 5 euro rule would not exist, because in the long run I am even more worthwhile than Highroller for the casino, because I lose more money

It is as Daniel described it. The Bonuses are paid out far too rarely ( 1-2 times a month at most ) so this makes even less sense. It would of course be different if I could choose a bonus every time, but the 5 euro rule is in no relation to the (tactical) thinking and payouts of reality.

Videoslots really sets a good example here. Simply do not accept the bet if it should go over the 5 euros. Therefore, I play there also prefer. Everything is fair and regulated. You do not try to pull the player over the table with any terms and conditions phrases. All the others could cut off a piece of that

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