Spinia: Criticism of Spinia when depositing with e-wallet

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Matthias wrote on 06/21/2019 at 10:26 am: Huhu Starwalker,

due to your private message I had a look at the case myself and also replied to you via private message.
Since this thread is certainly read by other users, I would like to briefly clarify why Spinia has behaved accordingly questionable.

To the facts
I think that Spinia did not violate the law even with the extensive document check, as the casinos have really hefty regulations from the MGA to avoid money laundering.

I had a chat with Caro, she said that at that time there were cases in Malta where money was laundered in the casinos and you can't rule it out until today. As a result, the testing regulations of the licensing authority are becoming more extensive every year and the penalties against the casinos are also getting tougher.
Overall, I still have the feeling that Spinia did not really act in a player-friendly way.
At least a function should have been provided long ago to block a payout, so that the player does not gamble away his money out of frustration. Unfortunately, there is still no legal regulation for this.
When I look at the whole thing from a technical point of view, I must honestly say that I am always shocked by how slowly the development departments of some casinos work. This does not mean that the casino or the operator is bad, but even if the boss would say "please change this function, build in a lock so that the players can protect themselves and we get less bad press", this is certainly often not implemented due to lack of expertise of the programmers.
My personal recommendation is therefore to write criticism directly to the casino and then look for another, technically mature casino. There are several of them in the casino list - my personal favorite is and remains SlotsMillion.


How does money laundering work in the casino? Is this just a pretext for not having to pay out?
For many, it may seem really ridiculous when casinos ask about the origin of the deposited money and then justify this question with "we have to check this for money laundering reasons".
Who doesn't immediately think "me and money laundering? They're crazy, I'm only depositing 50€ or 100€"
But money laundering does not usually take place in large amounts, but in hundreds of small sums.



The following practice is still used for money laundering in casinos
Person X sells drugs, guns, or other illegal items and makes a profit. For example, 5 illegal firearms sold at 250€ each, makes 1250€. Add to that drugs, a few grams here and there, again 500€ or even 1000€ revenue.
In my defense, I have no idea what a gun costs, let alone what a gram of cannabis or for cocaine is
is charged. Therefore, the above prices can of course vary up or down, but I assume that such stuff is probably more expensive.
But further in the story:
If this person would Deposit the money directly into his bank account and then possibly even regularly, so every few weeks here and there times 1000€ to the account, then this will certainly raise questions at the bank, because they also have to comply with audit obligations to report funds from illegal origin.

So person X now goes to a supermarket or gas station and buys for example a Paysafe card for 100€. Perhaps one or the other reader is already wondering why it is only possible to buy a maximum of 100€ per customer in the form of Paysafe cards in Germany...
The money is then deposited via PSC into a casino. The money is wagered there a few times, preferably with a small stake, so that not too much of it is lost and then the "win", quasi the deposit amount is paid out again to a bank account.

Person X then books a casino win on his legal private bank account, which is tax-free and clean. The drug money is thus laundered and can be used to pay his rent, buy a car or make investments.


This also explains why some casinos require a deposit to be turned over once before the money can be withdrawn.
At least then the casino can absolve themselves of the guilt that they have supported money laundering, since the player has behaved "regularly". Get it? Of course, the casinos will not publicly write such statements as I am making here, as that will probably still give people the idea to do just that.
But the fact is, the casinos are not all as shitty and dishonest as you think. There are certain requirements from the MGA and the Maltese Financial Supervisory Authority and those who do not comply Risk losing their license.
And in the meantime, I have also met some casino operators who are just as upset as the players about the fact that these bureaucratic hurdles are sometimes hard to meet. Casumo, in my experience, goes the 100% security route so that the license is not revoked. I also had to upload bank statements at the time to explain the origin of my wagered funds.
In Malta, this is called the "source of funds" check.

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Starwalker wrote on 08/06/2019 at 10:53 am
Yes a real partial blame has the casino too! After I made it known that ecoPayz no longer exists, I was still asked to upload anything...

Then I just had the email of the previous Deposit from bank account to Ecopayz.... That was then but also rejected and coal was back onm player account

An email with confirmation of the payment to Spinia directly I did not get from Ecopayz

I was already slowly so desperate that I had even asked the Ecopayz support by mail to reactivate my account

When I think about it in retrospect, it is absolutely outrageous that I was virtually forced to reactivate it although I do not want to use the Provider Ecopayz. But had tried it because I wanted to have the coal ..

With a few thousand on the clock I become a High Roller, you can imagine how quickly the coal runs down with 5-10 € spins

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Kleinkariert wrote on 06/22/2019 04:16 PM
The MGA doesn't really pay attention to what can be implemented in a meaningful way, they just keep putting more and more stuff on it without developing new systems that would lighten the load and make everything easier. The casinos on the other hand would be without the guidelines significantly worse, the earlier times it was online compared to today extremely bad.

Lack of expertise the programmers of a casino certainly do not have, the will is missing. These functions are not particularly complex, it is sometimes a few lines of code. If you can order the payout, there should only be a <Lock>function that disables the cancel button. So if the MGA prescribes that, you will see how quickly the function can then be installed, but you do not want that and the type of communication of some casinos also strongly suggests it (remember a casino that has always asked after withdrawal request whether you want to cancel and in case of loss there is a bit of Cashback lol...).

Then that a self-lock only by e-mail (with some it still goes in live chat) works. Many can embed this feature and even casinos of the same operator have different handling. This is clearly not a lack of competence, but deliberately so. Bonus rules you can violate because technically there is no barrier, bonus rules you have to read very very thoroughly because many rules are included and also pitfalls. Some casinos manage to be fair in many points, I can't give a number now, but it's not even 5% of casinos that really act normally and don't use every rule against the player.

UK Gambling has made it, meanwhile, must be displayed if after Deposit a check must take place. And especially with high payout amounts, you suddenly have to look very closely, and this is where the casino alienates the original intention of money laundering prevention. The origin would have to be checked at deposit and not at withdrawal. This is what bothers me incredibly. Of course, most casinos stick to the rules, you actually always get your money (have myself only 1 time my money not received because of bonus rules, have directly noticed my mistake and reported and result was I got 16 accumulated bonus rounds canceled and the Bonus money was deleted. Because I played 5 cents too far down and it was converted to real money. Instead of transferring me back, they lost me as a customer. After that, I was directly banned for life. Has one of course very regretted )

'''''''''''''''''''''''''''' Would like casinos also not only bad talk. But the casinos just act like normal companies with profit maximizing tendencies. One of the few reputable casinos was Videoslots a year ago. Very laudable behavior had, but the company has carried out drastic measures after the penalty and threw his good image in my view strongly in the dirt. Now it is just a good casino, before that it was by far the best casino for low rollers. Other casinos then come and take advantage of the opportunities Lapalingo has improved its bad reputation a good bit and now protects against violating bonus rules. Everywhere something changes, but this is largely market-driven behavior. There are few exceptions where the operator is a kind-hearted person who just wants to make a little profit, and it would also be fatal for the casino, because a casino needs large reserves just in case. Too good-hearted behavior leads sooner or later to the fact that one must close or must cut back strongly.

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